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Author Topic: New Can of Worms from Ganguly  (Read 19377 times)

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Blwe_torch

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #160 on: July 24, 2006, 02:56:19 PM »

Very nice!
I wish he stayed out of this murky politics.
He could have supported the CM's candidate, or his brother or anybody else.
But for that, he could have straightaway avoided counter-allegations against Dalmiya( or his group). That was unnecessary ..IMO.
Which player worth his salt could deny that he was not supported by Dalmiya in the past( including SG himself on many occasions)?

He was pressured to support the CM's/his brother's candidate, I understand.
But this does not justify his false allegation-campaigne via some stupid email.
I still have my doubts about what actually he has done or whether he really has sent an email/or its content, if yes.
I hope, he stays out of all this muck.
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ramshorns

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #161 on: July 24, 2006, 03:00:14 PM »

Very nice!
I wish he stayed out of this murky politics.
He could have supported the CM's candidate, or his brother or anybody else.
But for that, he could have straightaway avoided counter-allegations against Dalmiya( or his group). That was unnecessary ..IMO.
Which player worth his salt could deny that he was not supported by Dalmiya in the past( including SG himself on many occasions)?

He was pressured to support the CM's/his brother's candidate, I understand.
But this does not justify his false allegation-campaigne via some stupid email.
I still have my doubts about what actually he has done or whether he really has sent an email/or its content, if yes.
I hope, he stays out of all this muck.
Good post Blwe.  Good balanced analysis.  All said and done if SG can still make runs his name alone will get him in.  He does not need anyone.  But at this point sadly runs are deserting him.  We can all sit here and say what we want on he is a pawn etc.etc, but runs are the bottomline.
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Blwe_torch

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #162 on: July 24, 2006, 03:04:08 PM »

Yes, you are correct Ramsy!
I, being an SG-fan, am too bothered about any degradation of his legacy, that he has so painstakenly created.
All this email-hoopla seems well below his stature and altogether avoidable. I hope, he gets good advice from his father and other genuine well-wishers.
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ramshorns

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #163 on: July 24, 2006, 03:10:19 PM »

Yes, you are correct Ramsy!
I, being an SG-fan, am too bothered about any degradation of his legacy, that he has so painstakenly created.
All this email-hoopla seems well below his stature and altogether avoidable. I hope, he gets good advice from his father and other genuine well-wishers.
Well said and heartening to see this from the most avid of SG fans on this DG.   Instead of taking his side just for the sake of it you analysed the whole thing very well.  That's all we can do.  As fans we do not want our hero's image or legacy tarnished.  Let us hope from this point on SG will be very careful and stay away from all this kinds of stuff.  I still feel he has some cricket left in him if he has a clear mind and stays focussed.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006, 03:15:10 PM by ramshorns »
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Blwe_torch

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #164 on: July 24, 2006, 03:13:47 PM »

Yes, I hope so too.
This email affair was scary.
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prfsr

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #165 on: July 24, 2006, 03:44:32 PM »

Blwe,
I  think the email was genuine otherwise SG would have denied it by now.

Why he wrote the email, who knows? I do not think any of us can honestly either defend him or castigate him because we do not know the whole story yet. Maybe he made a bad mistake. Maybe he really wanted to go after JD no matter what the costs. We all make mistakes, and in this case it is clear that he will face the consequences, so I can live with that.
-P
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Blwe_torch

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #166 on: July 24, 2006, 03:53:21 PM »

Blwe,
I  think the email was genuine otherwise SG would have denied it by now.

Why he wrote the email, who knows? I do not think any of us can honestly either defend him or castigate him because we do not know the whole story yet. Maybe he made a bad mistake. Maybe he really wanted to go after JD no matter what the costs. We all make mistakes, and in this case it is clear that he will face the consequences, so I can live with that.
-P

Yes, this is, if it is...a faux pas :)
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prfsr

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #167 on: July 24, 2006, 04:00:06 PM »

Can anybody send me a link to SG's email? I thought I saw it on this DG but am having trouble locating it.

Thanks,
-P
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ramshorns

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #168 on: July 24, 2006, 04:18:11 PM »

Left split on CAB, Sourav dubbed opportunist
Monday, July 24 2006 18:20 Hrs (IST)


Kolkata: The CAB elections have left the Left Front split wide open with leaders making their preferences clear and with only six days to go for the polls and Sports Minister Subhas Chakraborty just upped the ante by calling Sourav Ganguly an 'opportunist'.

Talking to reporters here last night, Mr Chakraborty said, ''Sourav Ganguly no longer needs Jagmohan Dalmiya. He has got someone else to go ahead and so he has passed these comments against him.'' Asked if Sourav would be termed a 'traitor,' he said, ''No, not a traitor, but certainly an opportunist. In order to fulfil his own dreams and ambitions, some people just don't give much importance to ethics. These people just take chances as they present themselves.

They can use a trusted as a ladder to return to light from darkness.

You can call it something like this.
[/color]'' Chakraborty felt Sourav was using to team India all means to make a comeback and Dalmiya's criticism was a part of his efforts.

He recalled a personal incident to emphasise on that point, ''Early in his career I had taken personal initiative to send Sourav to play in county. This was not once, but twice. But has he ever talked about it. Forget talking about it. He never bothered to give a courtesy call on his return.'' ''I got the plane fare for him from the funds provided in the state government. But that's a long lost chapter,'' he said.

However, in an interview to a daily from London, when asked about it, Sourav said, '' Yes, it's true. Then I was 13.'' On whether he would he would react to the interference of state government in the CAB polls, he said, '' I won't say that Mr (Buddhadeb) Bhattacharjee wished that Dalmiya should not return to power. He had many complains against him. I was given a task to stop Dalmiya from standing. I failed and moved away.''

PWD minister and RSP heavyweight K*i Goswami also expressed his displeasure, ''The e-mail from Sourav has no purpose and the timing is just not right.'' ''It is because of Dalmiya that Chandi Ganguly's son has become Sourav Ganguly and the man is responsible for bringing some of the biggest cricket spectacles to Kolkata. But most importantly he has turned both BCCI and CAB from two cash stripped ailing bodies into cash cows,'' he said.

''CAB is an independent autonomous organisation and it will be best if it were to be left in that manner. We would not like any interference from any quarters,'' he said.

Asked about the state government's interference in the elections Chakraborty said, ''The state government has no role in it. The Chief Minister has his own preferences and we have ours. That is a different matter all together.'' The Chief Minister Buddhadeb Bhattacharya has asked Dalmiya not to contest but the Left Front may not hold the same views after all, as veteran Marxist and former Chief Minister Jyoti Basu has already voiced his ire on Police Commissioner Prasun Mukherjee fighting the polls.

Left Front Chairman and CPIM State secretary Biman Basu, however, stayed from taking sides, ''The Left front will not interfere in the CAB polls. It's an independent body and will function in its own way.'' Meanwhile, Trinamool Congress supremo Mamata Banerjee has pitched in favour of Jagmohan Dalmiya, making the CAB polls look like a full time political occupation.

 http://thatscricket.oneindia.in/news/2006/07/24/2407ganguly-criticism.html
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006, 04:21:38 PM by ramshorns »
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Jai

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #169 on: July 24, 2006, 04:35:17 PM »

The situation in Calcutta, as described by newspapers, is as follows.

1. Every past player who has commented has come out in support of Ganguly, or said that the allegations should be treated seriously. The opposition group in fact contains quite a few players.

2. Among politicians there is a great divide -- the "old" CPM, Jyoti Basu and people from his cabinet, are pro-JD. The newer, younger lot, including the current CM is for the opposing lot. They in fact pressured SG to come up with the email and support.

It is great to see that the same people on this DG who thought that communists were the devil go back and support Jyoti Basu. SG should join the CPM as a recruiter now :) The same people also thought JD was the devil, but I guess he too has become a great man these days :)

As for SG, there is an interview on ABP today. Sadly I do not have time to translate now, but I may be able to do it tonight if nobody else does it. In short, he refuses to talk about this and says that he considers his county stint unsuccessful so far in terms of scoring runs and is trying to accumulate as many runs in the remaining matches. Regarding his failures in the 4-day matches he says there are no valid reasons or excuses, he just was not able to settle down.
He also says something on the lines of he does not expect to be back unless he scores runs.

-P

May be you can also translate Debashish Dutta's (who also writes for Mid-Day) column from Aajkaal. Some of the non-Bengalis here are getting all excited reading only stuffs coming out of ABP. This Subhash Chakaroborty interview is also from ABP.

The other point these folks are forgetting while questioning SG's loyaity is that if SG were an opportunist, then he could have dumped JD as soon as JD lost power. If SG had brought these acusations 9-10 months back. may be he'd have come into good books of the Pawar section much earlier which in turn would have helped his comeback bid. But he didn't do anything of that sort. But now since he has chosen to support JD's opponents and accused someone in CAB for leaking the email, his loyalities are being questioned. I completely agree with you when say that 'The same people also thought JD was the devil, but I guess he too has become a great man these days :)'
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kban1

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #170 on: July 24, 2006, 04:37:32 PM »

Quote
''It is because of Dalmiya that Chandi Ganguly's son has become Sourav Ganguly..."

True, but lets also set the record straight here.

Jagmohan Dalmiya would not be the Jagguda of Indian cricket or of CAB had it not been for Chandi Ganguly's patronage when Dalmiya was a green horn and novice.

Loyalties between these 2 families are deeply intertwined. And the favors have not exactly flown in one direction.
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LosingNow

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #171 on: July 24, 2006, 04:46:09 PM »

<Guys no offense meant towards any community or region..just trying to have fun..in attempted choice punjabi>
CP:
(again DJ from RDB lingo!)
Oye..ki ho gaya en bengaliyon ko. pehn de takke, aapas mein lad bhid rahe hain. Oh pehn...d, ganguly ne hoya, koyi haivan ho gaya.

<again sorry, if it offends anyone, I will delete the post if it does>

..Loose English Translation per Prfsr's request. Mind you, it really is not as effective, in English...

Hey, what happened to these Bengalis (mockingly referrring to the cast of characters in this soap opera). SOBs (this is the closest I can get to translating this term, someone else may have a better translation for this term), fighting among themselves. expletive<a common expletive used as a term of endearment in a chat among friends>, as if Ganguly is god(or god's gift, one of them).

....
OK, let me know, if you still want to delete it. Now it will happen late in the night..I have a long flight to the East Coast.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006, 07:46:36 PM by losingnow »
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prfsr

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #172 on: July 24, 2006, 05:12:48 PM »

<Guys no offense meant towards any community or region..just trying to have fun..in attempted choice punjabi>
CP:
(again DJ from RDB lingo!)
Oye..ki ho gaya en bengaliyon ko. pehn de takke, aapas mein lad bhid rahe hain. Oh pehn...d, ganguly ne hoya, koyi haivan ho gaya.

<again sorry, if it offends anyone, I will delete the post if it does>

LN: since I understand nothing in your post, I decided to get offended (by tossing a coin).  ;D
You may delete the post or better, translate it for us.
-P
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flute202020

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #173 on: July 24, 2006, 05:26:22 PM »

I think to be fair to SG, I think it is not our or general public prerogative to sit in judgement if SG ditched JD(even though I guess such suggestions ar einevitable). We don't know the full story, may be JD did indeed in someway. But I am fairly certain that JD never made SG's selection difficult, may be used the email to divert attention. I am mainly upset because usually I don't like players getting involved in board politics, who knows, ultimately it might spread to dressing room too. Just make runs and stay out of trouble or controversies, being Fav son of Bengal, nobody can give SG hard deal if he shows some good form.

my 2 cents
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prfsr

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #174 on: July 24, 2006, 05:43:00 PM »

Flute,
Let's leave SG aside for just a moment -- "being Fav son of Bengal, nobody can give SG hard deal if he shows some good form." Do you really believe this? Is it true only for Bengal or for other states as well? So do some states have no favorite sons?

As you probably know, Bengal had many other favorite sons who were ignored time and again. Similarly for other states. 

Other questions: did SG ever do anything on his own merit or was his place in the team due to JD and JD only? In other words, without JD, would SG even have played for India? 

If JD used his backing to get SG in the tea and keep him there for 9 years, is SG the only guilty party? JD and his selector pawns were just doing their job?

-P
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flute202020

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #175 on: July 24, 2006, 05:50:47 PM »

Flute,
Let's leave SG aside for just a moment -- "being Fav son of Bengal, nobody can give SG hard deal if he shows some good form." Do you really believe this? Is it true only for Bengal or for other states as well? So do some states have no favorite sons?

As you probably know, Bengal had many other favorite sons who were ignored time and again. Similarly for other states. 

Other questions: did SG ever do anything on his own merit or was his place in the team due to JD and JD only? In other words, without JD, would SG even have played for India? 

If JD used his backing to get SG in the tea and keep him there for 9 years, is SG the only guilty party? JD and his selector pawns were just doing their job?

-P
prfsr , my point was, being "famous and fav son of bengal", is it easyfor say CM to hurt his business interests?
Also, with his fan base in bengal & outside, if he shows some good form, is it easy to keep him out? suppose he really clicked with say 3 centuries and couple of 50s in county, don't you think there will be lot of noise & support for his recall? remember how much pressure there was for Pak tour selection? say he made a 50 or 60 in one of the matches in Pak, do you think they could have dropped him? all along, the perceived injustice to SG as described by SG fans is based on borderline cases and depending on previous controversy, GC & KM are being castigated. As of now, I don't think SG got any injustice in matters of selection.
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prfsr

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #176 on: July 24, 2006, 06:21:18 PM »

Meanwhile Sg is dismissed for 5 in the 20-20 QF.
-P
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dhruvdeepak

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #177 on: July 24, 2006, 06:44:38 PM »

by a guy called Sidebottom no less  ;D. Not to worry, the batsman after him got out to Shreck  ;D
meanwhile Kumble has bowled 3 overs 1-14 in the other QF, with the wicket of Ian Harvey who is a brilliant 20-20 player
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LosingNow

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #178 on: July 25, 2006, 08:00:57 AM »

Asian Age..
--
http://www.asianage.com/?sam=2:1:235:237536&headline=%E2%80%98Ganguly~is~an~opportunist%E2%80%99
 
‘Ganguly is an opportunist’ 7/25/2006 1:54:11 AM
- By Our Correspondent
 

Kolkata, July 24: West Bengal sports minister Subhas Chakraborty has rubbished Sourav Ganguly insinuations that Jagmohan Dalmiya and his associates had leaked coach Greg Chappell’s controversial email and said that those being targeted by the former India captain were "innocent".

Mr Chakraborty also called the Bengal left-hander an "opportunist" who in order to fulfill his dreams and ambitions "did not give much importance to ethics."

"Ganguly’s allegations are not correct. I can say with full responsibility that those, against whom he has had made the allegation did not leak the email," Mr Chakraborty told reporters at the state Assembly on Monday.

The previous night, he commented: "Sourav Ganguly no longer needs Jagmohan Dalmiya. He has got someone else to go ahead so he has passed these comments against him." Asked if Ganguly could be termed a traitor, Mr Chakraborty said: "No not a traitor, but certainly an opportunist. These people just take the chances as they present themselves. These people can use a trusted as a ladder to return to light from darkness."

Citing an example of him once having helped Ganguly, the sports minister said: "Early in his career when he was only 13, I had taken a personal initiative to send Sourav to play in the county cricket (minor league) in England. This was not once but twice. But has he ever talked about it? He never even bothered to thank me with a call on return."

However, in an interview to a Bengali Daily from England, when asked about it, Sourav said: "Yes it’s true." But he reportedly refused further comment on the issue "to avoid further controversy". Mr Chakraborty has been trying to find a compromise formula between the two warring groups.
----

Deccan Chronicle..
Buddha vs Dalmiya: Smell the leather
 

Kolkata. July 24: West Bengal Chief Minister Buddhadeb Bhattacharjee wants Cricket Association of Bengal (CAB) president Jagmohan Dalmiya ousted from his post in the new CAB elections because he is annoyed about the Bantala Leather Complex issue.

But the Chief Minister’s open cry for a change in the CAB management has its own history. At the root of the Chief Minister’s ire lies the agreement between M.L. Dalmiya & Co. and the State government, which was signed while Mr Jyoti Basu was chief minister. Sources said the agreement was drafted by Mr Dalmiya’s solicitor and contained certain clauses that prevented the State government from taking steps against Mr Dalmiya for failing to complete the work within the stipulated time.

Kolkata police commissioner Prasun Mukherjee is contesting against Mr Dalmiya, but he is only doing Mr Bhattacharjee’s bidding. And even though Mr Dalmiya has State sports minister Subhash Chakraborty and State PWD minister Khiti Goswami behind him, the real contest will be Mr Bhattacharjee versus Mr Dalmiya.

Earlier efforts to unseat Mr Dalmiya, who is not in the good books of the ruling Left Front but has had a stranglehold on the CAB for decades, proved futile when former police commissioner Dinesh Vajpai, who was pitted against him in 2005, was defeated. Mr Vajpai, too, had the Chief Minister’s blessings. Mr Dalmiya and Mr Vajpai once crossed swords over the law and order situation during an international match at Eden Gardens. When the spectators turned unruly, Mr Vajpai, the then Kolkata police commissioner, wanted to call off the match.

Mr Dalmiya shot down his suggestion, reportedly saying: “Who are you to call off the match?” Mr Bhattacharjee had this incident in mind when he asked Mr Vajpai to contest. But he  managed to secure only 13 votes.  The Chief Minister had earlier asked the State sports minister to advise Mr Dalmiya to stay out of the race for CAB president. In reply, Mr Dalmiya sent a five-page letter which included three proposals.

Insiders revealed that Mr Dalmiya had promised to opt out if the state government promised to back him in his legal battle against the BCCI. As a second proposal, he suggested four names for candidates for the CAB presidential polls — former West Bengal Chief Minister Siddhartha Shankar Ray, former Kolkata mayor Kamal Basu, Mr Subhash Chakraborty and Lok Sabha Speaker Somnath Chatterjee.

His third proposal was that apart from the president, his entire panel should be backed to victory. Mr Chatterjee, Mr Basu and Mr Chakraborty were unwilling, but Mr Ray agreed. But the chief minister rejected the idea.

Meanwhile, a high-profile state minister went to New Delhi to attend a meeting of the urban development ministry. There he met BCCI president Sharad Pawar to discuss the issue of Sourav Ganguly’s comeback. During the meeting, Mr Pawar put Mr Dalmiya’s ouster from the CAB as quid pro quo for Sourav’s reinduction, the sources said.

The choice of the present contender — the Kolkata police commissioner — was not unanimous. Sources said that to ensure Mr Dalmiya’s defeat, the chief minister met other former cricket players and a few heavyweights at the residence of a journalist where the names of State urban development minister Ashok Bhattacharjee, mayor Bikash Bhattacharjee and the city police commissioner were discussed.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2006, 08:07:01 AM by losingnow »
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fineleg

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #179 on: July 25, 2006, 08:38:21 AM »

if SG back becos of quid pro quo, shame on pawar!
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jaat69

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Re: New Can of Worms from Ganguly
« Reply #180 on: July 25, 2006, 09:32:25 AM »

if SG back becos of quid pro quo, shame on pawar!

No, shame on Chappel!
His hypnosis should have lasted longer!~ ;D
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